Australia: Lockdowns and Location Apps | John Anderson | The JBP Podcast – S4: E:50

This episode was recorded on September 9th.

Dr. Jordan Peterson and John Anderson exchange ideas about the freedom of conscience, policies, and mandatory vaccines. Dr. Jordan shares his experience with policies while Anderson shares tips on conducting proper debates while commenting on the governmental debates. See how Australia connects to their discussion and how social media came into play.

John Anderson is a sixth-generation farmer and grazier from New South Wales, who spent 19 years in the Australian Parliament. After serving in politics, Anderson launched a web-based interview program, Conversations with John Anderson, featuring interviews with public intellectuals. He continues to serve the interests of Australia’s rural and regional communities.

Find more John Anderson on his website
Check out his YouTube channel:
Check out his Facebook:
Follow him on Twitter:


● [00:00] Dr. Peterson introduces this week’s guest, John Anderson.
● [03:32] “The problem with fighting fire with fire is that you end up burning.” Dr. Peterson
● [03:54] What’s happening in Australia and the west?
● [04:26] John’s tips for proper debates.
● [06:17] How Anderson views Australia’s regime.
● [06:40] China’s imposed threat on Australia.
● [09:09] John quoting Henry Kissinger on freedom.
● [09:47] The legality of mandatory vaccines in western culture and the blitz story during WWII in Britain.
● [11:48] Anderson’s analogy of democracy.
● [14:31] Dr. Peterson’s advice on policies.
● [16:05] The lockdowns in Australia.
● [22:07] Dr. Peterson’s perspective towards proper political force on vaccinations.
● [21:26] The cost of safety.
● [25:29] John’s opinion on debates.
● [26:56] Breaking down trust in the government.
● [31:53] How governmental debates should be conducted.
● [37:21] Freedom of Conscious.
● [43:10] The best rationale for mandatory vaccines.
● [53:01] Lockdowns and the dangers of mandating medical procedures.
● [59:46] The power of social media and John’s thoughts on moving forward.
● [01:02:19] Social media and John’s podcast.
● [01:06:47] Anderson’s thoughts on freedom and governments.
● [01:10:15] Australian politicians’ understanding of social media.

Visit to view more information about Jordan, his books, lectures, social media, blog posts, and more.
Jordan B. Peterson is a professor of psychology at the University of Toronto, a clinical psychologist, and the author of the multi-million copy bestseller 12 Rules for Life: An Antidote to Chaos, #1 for nonfiction in 2018 in the US, Canada, the UK, Australia, New Zealand, Sweden, the Netherlands, Brazil and Norway, and slated for translation into 50 languages.
Dr. Peterson has appeared on many popular podcasts and shows, including the Joe Rogan Experience, The Rubin Report, H3H3, and many more. Dr. Peterson’s own podcast has focused mainly on his lecture series, covering a great deal of psychology and historical content. Jordan is expanding his current podcast from lectures to interviews with influential people around the world. We hope you enjoy this episode and more to come from Dr. Peterson in the future.


Discovering Personality:
Self Authoring Suite:
Understand Myself (personality test):

// BOOKS //
Beyond Order: 12 More Rules for Life:
12 Rules for Life: An Antidote to Chaos:
Maps of Meaning: The Architecture of Belief:

// LINKS //
Reading List:

// SOCIAL //

Interested in sponsoring my audio podcast? Reach out to my advertising team here:

Written by Jordan B Peterson

Dr. Jordan B Peterson is a professor and clinical psychologist. The videos are derived from two sources: 1. His UToronto courses Maps of Meaning (which describes how values, including beliefs about good and evil, regulate emotion and motivation); and Personality & Its Transformations (which describes psychological theories from Eliade, Jung, Freud, Rogers, Gray, Luria, Sokolov, Vinogradova, Panksepp, Nietzsche, Kierkegaard, and Solzhenitsyn as well as psychometric models such as the Big Five). 2. His public lectures on topics of general psychological relevance, including the meaning of music, the significance of hero mythology, and the structure of the world as represented in religion.


  1. It's important to note that Biden's Vaccine Mandate for companies over 100 employees isn't get vaccinated period. The exact policy states "The Department of Labor’s Occupational Safety and Health Administration (OSHA) is developing a rule that will require all employers with 100 or more employees to ensure their workforce is fully vaccinated or require any workers who remain unvaccinated to produce a negative test result on at least a weekly basis before coming to work." So testing weekly is an option. This is VERY important when stating that we've "mandated" anything.

  2. As an Australian the problem for me is that the world thinks this is Australia now, it's not. It's always been this way. Government, free settler's and everyone else and as far as the first two are concerned everyone else can go to hell.

  3. "In a Democracy, we do enter into a compact and say 'we'll surrender those rights and hopefully no more than those rights which are necessary to secure the rights and freedoms of others'"

    No, there are no fundamental human rights in any ideological/political system like the Democratic ones, and you do not enter into any agreement to give up your rights. In a time of emergency and catastrophe, there may be cause to accept TEMPORARY restriction of CERTAIN rights, but you do NOT enter into ANY agreement to BECOME or JOIN a Democracy. To BE a Democracy is to GIVE those rights, not take them away.

    Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

  4. So many things are out of whack! Why we cannot play sports but we can go to the pub? Why our children are not allowed to exercise?
    A whole new generation of law breaking has been born, they have been taught that rules have to be broken to live a good life.

  5. Thanks JP & JA. I’m from Melbourne and these are the topics that need to be vigorously discussed, especially in my view that there is a terrible theft from our youth which has been going on for far too long.

  6. Jordan, “It might be okay if ‘antivaxers’ needed to be forced to be vaccinated because they’re too stupid to what’s good for them’…. I’m beginning to like him.

  7. My issue is that the call for these mandatory vaccinations is they don't acknowledge the existence of natural immunity acquired from having had Covid and recovered. Once you've had it any additional benefit from the vaccinations is minimal at best.

  8. I have to wonder, if Trump had been re-elected would the vaccine thing been so politically aligned with left vs right? If not, then would John and Jordan been arguing these points? Or are they simply jumping in the ring to defend the ‘team’. Team RIGHT.

  9. "I understand medically that there is a distinct possibility that that precise thing may happen" (unforseen long term consequences) . Mmmmm, well thats the reason why we should at least slow down the rollout

  10. Wow. Scary to take a look at your comments here. So many ridiculous conspiracy theorists, and among individuals who quite clearly don't have minimal thinking ability. Holy.

  11. Give people the choice to become vaccinated and let those who choose to not become vaccinated live with the consequences of their decision.

    As a part of those consequences, if there is ever a need to make a choice between providing an intensive care bed to an unvaccinated COVID patient and someone else who needs it for another reason (e.g automobile accident or heart attack), the unvaccinated COVID patient would have to not be given the intensive care bed, even if that means they die, as they have chosen of their own free will to not take the preventative measures available to them to prevent the illness.

    Perhaps make those who choose not to get vaccinated sign waivers to acknowledge that they are aware of the consequences of their choice.

  12. According to a news article a few years ago, canada has over 35000 medical error fatalities every year and with the pandemic we are just approaching the 3500o deaths after two years, but we are just supposed to ignore those deaths, when every other profession is held criminally responsible for deaths caused by errors resulting in injury or death.

  13. It's just occurring to me that another pandemic we are suffering is one of cult leader birth. Popping up like mushrooms 🍄 ..all these wannabe cult leaders 🤣😬.
    Don't get sucked in.

  14. COVID has become, purely, a political weapon. IF we were dealing with a true “pandemic” [like 1918?, or the Black Plague] … no one would need convincing to use the vaccine… it would be self evident, we would get it to save our asses… Jordan’s analogy about driving cars is perfect… I would escalate with the notion of riding motorcycles… even more dangerous and [JUST like COVID] mostly more dangerous to the person riding than the others that share the road with us bike riders.

    This whole thing has reached a ridiculous level made worse by a large number of people who give the medical profession FAR to much credit [hypochondriacs?]. And we all know this kind of person… obsessed by what medicine they need next, stuffing pills down their gullets trying to cure their symptoms… instead of dealing with the ROOT cause. Loosing the “trees, for the forest”.

    Eventually we all die…. Get over it! Quality of life is important….really important, in fact. Please let us live on our own terms. If you believe you need the vaccine… then get it and thank God there is one. If you believe in its efficacy… then don’t worry about wether or not I get sick and die! I present NO risk to you, AND if I die, there will be one less idiot [in your eyes] to take up valuable space on this earth. A “win-win” in your eyes. Give me liberty or give me death.

  15. I apologize to Jordan Peterson for what I am about to say, very harshly indeed: We do not, did not, surrender ANY rights; that is a damned fallacy! The fallacy of some social compact justices love to use. We ONLY agreed to be in a Repiblic under law and constitution. I repeat: All Rights are indeed reserved. That is a common ruse in law. Are you guys nuts ? "All Rights are reserved"! Read your own books and see what they say. Some Rights may be lost in a civil tort or a murder investigation. Go back and read the laws, The Common Law of England. Just what the hell are you trying to do in slipping in this "social compact" fallacy? Compact=contract=intent are synonymous. One can be outside of ANY and ALL statutory compacts, see: stateless. Sui Juris.

  16. Dr Petersen I would have loved you had this podcast with Malcolm Turnbull instead of John Anderson. Any great conversation and debate is all about the good hard questions being asked and answered honestly. I would have loved to have seen more honesty in responses from John especially when asked…"but what is the real harm to the vaccinated, from those unvaccinated ??? Now there was a que for some real good discussion about what the vaccines are suppose to give us, but John didn't have any meaningful answer to that question.

  17. Two coping boomers slowly coming to a realization that the world as they knew it is no more.

    Just wait till they realize that there is no amount of voting, debating, or whatever other liberal-democratic delusions that will get us out of it.

  18. Disgusting how Labour Premiers made out Astrazenica was potentially harmful , while complaining about the lack of Pfeizer and Moderna , using "health regulations" to
    undermine the Morrison government. at the expense of the peoples "safety" . The EU did the same to punish Brexit Britain.

  19. There's no conclusive upto date research that has demonstrated that the vaccinated do NOT carry and transmit covid significantly similar as the unvaccinated. So vaccine status in relation to protecting others is meaningless and vaccine passports are no where near as effective as testing for preventing transmission.

    If anything vaccine passports could lead people into a false sense of security where they are a danger to the vulnerable believing their safe and taking risks they otherwise would not.

    Also looking at the breakthrough case's it's obvious this is more a treatment mitigater rarther then a vaccine as we think of them in the typical sterilisation sense.

    I don't need reactions every six months with God knows what long term effects they might have and as natural immunity has been proven time and again better than the vaccine then please take my vaccine and give it to someone who is vulnerable in the 3rd world.