DarkHorse Podcast with Douglas Murray & Bret Weinstein: View from an Outpost of the American Empire

Douglas Murray is an author of Multiple books including his most recent one; The Madness of Crowds, and associate editor at The Spectator. He discusses with Bret the collapse of American cities such as Portland, how we end up here, and what will come next.

Find Douglas’s new book: The Madness of Crowds (
Find Douglas on Twitter: @DouglasKMurray

Theme Music: Thank you to Martin Molin of Wintergatan for providing us the rights to use their excellent music.

Written by Bret Weinstein


  1. Poverty. Bret acts like there are no poor whites. Much of class issues are being mislabeled as racism. If racism is the cause, how do you explain people like in Appalachia and West Virginia?

  2. The discussion about Antifa fighting a fading shadow enemy. That's exactly the problem. They hero worship the civil rights activists of the past.
    They wish they were fighting in the streets against racist cops. They wish they were in Selma in the 60's. They're back fighting a victory.
    Their fight is mostly against the diminishing prospects in American society, and their own ennui.
    They're confused,coddled,and undoubtedly being propped up by too many liberal enablers. Parents mostly.
    They may think they mean well. But it's a disaster.
    Antifa/BLM want enemies to fight. Want.

  3. Bret and Douglas. Pretty much a dream team of socio-political philosophy. Douglas has no clue about THC, but nobody's perfect. Thanks for this. Persevere. Reality always wins.

  4. Fatherless black families. Can't believe you completely miss an important factor. Democratic welfare policies in the 70's made it financially beneficial to not have a father in the home. Government replaced men and has been a poor parent. 3 generations of this have permanently altered the black family dynamic.

    Few are imprisoned for pot. Most in for crack. Harsher penalties were advanced by the Congressional Black Caucus and later by Bill Clinton. Not conservatives fault.

  5. @2:00:00: talking about China. Comparing its culture to “yeast” and being “pointless”. I’ve lived in China mainland and Hong Kong for 40 years. Suggest Douglas and Bret visit China, meet its artists, its writers, its think-tank people, its average people in the street before passing such noxious and ignorant garbage. (I have no time for thuggish Xi Jinping and his regime, to be clear. But China is more than Beijing).

  6. I think a thorough study of the events that transpired in Germany Between WW1 & 1933 (when Hitler became Chancellor) could benefit the situation that is coalescing in the US RIGHT NOW. The mistrust, the running battles in the streets, the inequality, and the most important point: the fact that voters rushed to the poles of politics during those difficult times. there were socialist/communists, and facists battling it out in the streets of Munich. while the government (such as it was) and the police were caught in the middle. I say this to the people on both sides of politics. IF YOU WISH FOR A COMMUNIST OR FACIST REVOLUTION, BE CAREFUL WHAT YOU WISH FOR!!! BECAUSE THESE REVOLUTIONS OFTEN THROW FORWARD THE WORST KIND OF PERSON.

  7. Excellent conversation, Douglas brought out "but the even harder conversation to have" i.e. uncontrolled births, differentiation of strata and reasons of homlessness and then benefiting from having an illness. We need "boundaries" he argues, or mechanisms (Bret) to prevent this. I would argue, we cannot have high ideal attainment, without addressing the greatest limiting factors preventing the health of our civilization, which is uncontrolled births. Government regulated birth halt. We cannot afford the vast burden we are forcing on this planet and our future generations.

  8. So disappointing they didn't discuss creativity, which is the glue between individualism and collectivism. You cannot reconcile them separately, you need an open framework of understanding. Just about any idea can be both liberal and conservative depending on your perspective, you get confused just by defining the terms. In my opinion setting aside existence itself, all ideas are provisional, it is called adaptation. It may seem counter-intuitive, but societies always reach a bottleneck when they become unimaginative. I am not talking about lots of content and lots of copies of just anything. I am talking about originality, completely new stuff. Naturally that requires more focus on the future rather than the past. Incentivizing competitiveness, usefulness, and talent at the same time.

  9. Four years ago I graduated at 60 years old with concurrent degrees in the Liberal Arts. Unlike the majority of my much younger classmates, I knew when our curriculum was manipulated fantasy. For the grade I had to select THE most outrageously idiotic answer on exams–courtesy of intersectionality Progressivism and critical race theory. I was stunned to witness that the vast majority of my classmates in 300-400 level courses at a major university could not write an essay or even limited paragraphs in our online modules. Neither could they utilize critical-thinking skills or conduct cursory research. I had to vigorously negotiate with two professors just for the opportunity to write a research paper more than 8 pages long! Several of my large lecture courses featured tenured instructors who were untalented and/or dispassionate. They delegated too much to young teaching assistants and seemed to take pride in subjective commentary or outright fomentation of Leftist ideology designed to generate emotional reactions from students instead of imparting legitimate knowledge and skills.
    My success to fulfill a lifelong dream to acquire my education was dampened by the realization that a university degree is often meaningless. I graduated summa cum laude but the distinction is impotent considering the rate of graduates who know so little and were intellectually challenged hardly ever. My subsequent interaction with advanced degreed individuals in the higher education system where I was employed served to underscore this disappointment. The Dean that flooded me with her tyrannical e-mails and threatening visits could not construct a single message without numerous grammatical/spelling errors unrelated to a typo. Her horrible management style as a bully spewing unethical decisions left a wide swath of damage in her wake in every department under her oversight. In the end the unethical actions embraced illegal actions; I sued and won. My experience with higher education as a complex hostile workplace environment is an all too frequent trauma for thousands of innocent individuals. Progressivism directly encourages arrogance, entitlement, and dehumanization of "other" within strict, inflexible hierarchies all the while loudly advocating for "justice", "equality", and "inclusion". It could have and should have been vastly more positive.

  10. SInce you are so clever, you must have looked into the fact's about this so called PANDEMIC. A world scam to bring down the population,, look up Even 201 , is it that hard to realice something goofy is taking place then go look uo project lockstep, if that's not enough check out World Health Forum, Agenda 2030 and there is more …. OPEN YOUR EYES!

  11. choices have consequences. We all know them, so it is not anyone's fault other than your own, when you are negatively affected by those actions that lead to those consequences.

  12. Question for the other rational thinkers out there: This is the most intellectually packed conversation I've seen in a long while. The question is, is it too late for intellectuals examining the problems and discussing solutions to make any impact in the minds of these 'revolutionaries'?

  13. This podcast was fascinating, really one of the best I've ever seen. I enjoyed hearing the perspective on what is going on in America from a non-American such as Douglas Murray. USA could really be on the brink. Thank you Brett for sounding the alarm! Don't give up, we are listening.

  14. Could educating single parented children differently help them? For instance instilling the most likely missing values from what a child should get from the absent parent in some manner? And obviously would it even be viable on a scale of success. I guess parentless starts in the home but can it be effected more positively at the education institutions?

  15. So it seems the missing link from all sides could be the internal realization that my wellbeing can't be unless what surrounds me also is in a state of wellbeing.
    So, if I have plenty and I'm surrounded by those whom struggle for essentials, my wellbeing is incomplete. At the same time, the contrary also apply. If I'm in struggle and I can't be neutral if not partecipative towards those whom are fuortune then I can't start my own engine to get to my own wellbeing.
    Instead of destroying all structure to be equal under the umbrella of misery we could nurture the ability of humans to see themselves in the projected image of others.
    That's not even a high aim in my view.

  16. I've heard Bret's argument about benevolent state (liberal democracy), however, in order to determine who is at fault, who should pay the prices for covering someone's misfortune, you run into planned economy situation where someone's gonna lose in the end. Also it sounds authoritarian as heck. I think Douglas' comment previously "who's gonna pay for this, and who decide what are the metrics" is very instructive.

  17. “I am for doing good to the poor, but…I think the best way of doing good to the poor, is not making them easy in poverty, but leading or driving them out of it. I observed…that the more public provisions were made for the poor, the less they provided for themselves, and of course became poorer. And, on the contrary, the less was done for them, the more they did for themselves, and became richer.”

    ― Benjamin Franklin

  18. In gonna be honest, I don’t see America recovering from what’s happening. I think that’s impossible at this point. Too many areas of the dam are breaking. There will be a flood.

  19. There will be a war. But it will be a war waged by a totalitarian elite against the masses. The Great Reset which is increasingly being talked about. These lockdowns, contact tracing and impending mandatory "vaccinations" are already the opening shots.

  20. Bret says that more equitable distribution is needed to maximise incentives and optimise production. I'm not so sure if that is technically right. Think of the lottery. We all know that we won't win, but the enormous prize makes us try. Think of a graduate joining a to accounting of law firm with a partnership structure that is a pyramid scheme enriching the partners at the pinnacle. The graduates play the career lottery because of the huge prize at the pinnacle. They will work weekends and nights for five years before they get discarded, believing that they are luckier than all the others.